Need feedback on idea for fighting author obscurity

[DRMarvello]

I'm putting together a web site that is designed to help authors in a specific genre meet other authors, build their blog following, and get the word out about their books. It started out as an "anti-obscurity campaign." The Internet has plenty of sites and author campaigns that do these things already, but most of them are not focused on a specific genre or type of book (at least, not that I've found). The market I'm targeting is what I call "magical fantasy," which is any fantasy book that includes some form of magic.

The main features of the site include a Book Sale page (with a list of participating books) and an Authors page (with a list of participating authors.) The site also has the requisite registration form for authors and a "Post Exchange" form that facilitates the exchange of blog posts (e.g. interviews, guest posts, reviews, and giveaways). I don't sell any books on the site itself. The buy links all go to online retailers like Amazon.com.

One theory (to be proven) behind this project is that readers would like a place where they know they can find magical fantasy books. Since many of the authors are unknown, the Author page lets readers learn more about them. The other theory that drives the project is that helping authors who write the same kind of books get to know each other and promote one another helps us all get better known, particularly in our market segment.

My questions for my KB friends are these:

• Does the idea of a site like this appeal to you as a reader? Does a site focusing on a specific genre of books and authors have value to you?
• Would you take advantage of having author information readily available (including links to a blog, interviews, etc)?
• Does the idea appeal to you as an author?
• Does being able to network with other authors in your own genre have more value than just networking with other authors in general?

You don't have to be a magical fantasy author to comment. Just mentally replace that genre with your own. I'd give you a link to the site, but I can't tell from the KB rules if that is allowed.

[LisaGraceBooks]

To get out of obscurity you have to market to readers, not other authors. My Facebook page is one big author lovefest. It doesn't help me sell books. My website does. Almost everyone there is a diehard fan. Same with Google +, twitter, and Pintrest.

As a matter-of -fact, a great idea is--we avoid each other  as much as possible on social media and concentrate on building reader/fans. Then when you do a #samplesunday or some kind of other promotion it really pays off.

[Gregory Lynn]

To get out of obscurity you have to market to readers, not other authors. My Facebook page is one big author lovefest. It doesn't help me sell books. My website does. Almost everyone there is a diehard fan. Same with Google +, twitter, and Pintrest.

As a matter-of -fact, a great idea is--we avoid each other  as much as possible on social media and concentrate on building reader/fans. Then when you do a #samplesunday or some kind of other promotion it really pays off.

I'm going to disagree a bit. It seems obvious to me that if someone likes one writer in a genre that there is a pretty good chance they're going to like another writer in the same genre. Since people come to books in all kinds of ways that we can't always explain, a certain cross pollination of fanbases strikes me as a good thing.

Of course, I have no fanbase to offer at the moment but I think such a thing would have value to me as a reader and as a writer.

My caveats are that a) it seems like a lot of work, b) I am not sure how it would generate enough income to support itself let alone repay the effort that went into it, and c) since obscure writers would get more out of it than the better known, it might just become a small pond of literary onanism.

But it's worth a shot.

[DRMarvello]

To get out of obscurity you have to market to readers, not other authors. My Facebook page is one big author lovefest. It doesn't help me sell books. My website does. Almost everyone there is a diehard fan. Same with Google +, twitter, and Pintrest.

When you say your website sells your books, is that a book website specifically, or are you just talking about your blog?

That is why I was hoping to make it something that would appeal to readers. The "book sale" aspect would hopefully bring in readers of the genre who know they can find the kind of books they like. Each book listing includes a cover image, description, link to the book web site, a buy link, and links to whatever book reviews/giveaways have been posted by the participating authors.

The "book tour" aspect is for the authors themselves. The Post Exchange works like an informal book tour, where the participating authors tour each others blogs by exchanging posts.

[DRMarvello]

I'm going to disagree a bit. It seems obvious to me that if someone likes one writer in a genre that there is a pretty good chance they're going to like another writer in the same genre. Since people come to books in all kinds of ways that we can't always explain, a certain cross pollination of fanbases strikes me as a good thing.

I hope you are right. That kind of thinking is what led me down the path to the idea in the first place.

Of course, I have no fanbase to offer at the moment but I think such a thing would have value to me as a reader and as a writer.

My caveats are that a) it seems like a lot of work, b) I am not sure how it would generate enough income to support itself let alone repay the effort that went into it, and c) since obscure writers would get more out of it than the better known, it might just become a small pond of literary onanism.

But it's worth a shot.

Your caveats are well taken.
a) It has been a lot of work, but it will be worth it if it works.
b) I don't actually expect it to pay for itself. If I had to outsource all the work that went into it, I would not have done it. As it is, I was able to do everything myself at the cost of my time only.
c) The theory is that all of us together have more leverage than any of us singly. Any gain in exposure is better than none (I hope).

If the site is successful at attracting readers, we might get a few less obscure authors to join us. That helps everyone, although admittedly, the most obscure are helped the most. But I've learned that authors are mostly very generous with one another, and a more famous author might think the whole idea just looks like fun.

[Nathan Lowell]

My questions for my KB friends are these:

• Does the idea of a site like this appeal to you as a reader? Does a site focusing on a specific genre of books and authors have value to you?
• Would you take advantage of having author information readily available (including links to a blog, interviews, etc)?
• Does the idea appeal to you as an author?
• Does being able to network with other authors in your own genre have more value than just networking with other authors in general?

In order:

No. No.
No.
No.
No.

Don't confuse network with platform.

Working with other writers to cross pollinate reader-bases works pretty well, but it's not necessarily genre specific -- which is, I think, the thrust of the anticipated action. What's more important is whether or not the readerships are sufficiently compatible. Most people who like David Weber will not like my stuff. It's too touchy-feely and not enough bloodshed happens. A lot of my readers -- hardcore space opera and sf fans -- love Modwitch's contemporary fantasy. We have a sensibility in the story that's similar enough that they're willing to overlook the genre discrepancy.

Networking does work, but it has to be done carefully. It does you no good to network willy-nilly. It just creates a low value, high-noise network where you trade obscurity for static. If you want to do it, find somebody who writes stuff you like. Build your network on mutual respect and sensibility. Leverage your individual strengths, but don't automatically assume that the two audiences will blend -- or even appreciate being told about the other's work.

You can't overcome obscurity by starting a new club. There are already a lot of clubs like this -- Goodreads, LibraryThing, Shelfari ... Kindleboards.

If you want people to notice you, you'll have to do something remarkable.

JMO. YMMV.

[DRMarvello]

You can't overcome obscurity by starting a new club. There are already a lot of clubs like this -- Goodreads, LibraryThing, Shelfari ... Kindleboards.

If you want people to notice you, you'll have to do something remarkable.

Thanks for your response. I figured I was being spoiled by the first authors I talked to who jumped at the idea (a few have already joined for the first tour in March).

I do hope that my "new club" will have something that Goodreads and the others do not: Specificity. It may be as you say, that being genre-specific won't have much appeal. I hope you are wrong about readers of one author not having an interest in work by others. If that were true, book tours, which aren't necessarily even genre-specific, would be a total waste of time.

[Sean Patrick Fox]

As an author, this definitely appeals to me. There's nothing better than having another avenue to connect with readers and help your work find a larger audience.

As a reader, I would be cautiously interested in perusing the site. It would have to have a lot of works on there, and I would prefer some sort of quality control filter. I'm much less forgiving of bad writing, editing, formatting, etc as a reader than I am as a writer. So I don't know how interested I'd be in a site that's open to all.

That being said, one of the most important things to me would be that the site is easily navigable, and that it's done professionally. There are few things more annoying than a website that's clearly been designed by an amateur.

[DRMarvello]

As a reader, I would be cautiously interested in perusing the site. It would have to have a lot of works on there, and I would prefer some sort of quality control filter. I'm much less forgiving of bad writing, editing, formatting, etc as a reader than I am as a writer. So I don't know how interested I'd be in a site that's open to all.

I hear ya. I struggle with that one myself. Here on KB we've all had that argument about whether or not there should be some kind of seal of approval. I just can't get on board that train. I've read books that drove me crazy with bad formatting, typos, and other errors, yet learned that readers love them anyway. I can't put myself in the position of deciding whether or not another author's work is "good enough for my site."

I figure that the books offered on the site will be the same mix of books you find everywhere else: some great, some not so great, but each one great to its own crowd. I think readers are pretty savvy about spotting the stinkers. Excerpts speak volumes.

BTW: I sent you a PM with a link to the site so you can take a look.

[Gregory Lynn]

You can't overcome obscurity by starting a new club.

I hate to say it but this makes sense.

If you want people to notice you, you'll have to do something remarkable.

Now you're just being logical. We can't have that here.

[telracs]

If it's a website where "authors meet other authors", what's in it for me as a reader? 

If it's a website where authors of a particular genre take turns blogging, advertising, taking questions from readers, then maybe. 

[DRMarvello]

I hate to say it but this makes sense.

I actually agree too, but I'd say it a different way: The way to overcome obscurity is to write a remarkable book.

With this new site, I'm not trying to "overcome" obscurity so much as take the sharp edges off, make some new author friends, and give our readers a place where we can show them what we have.

[psychotick]

I agree with the others. A site for authors to meet and cross polinate etc is great and all, but other authors are only a small to tiny percentage of your readership. If it was going to work as you want you'd have to drag in some big authors with their own followings and then hang off their coat tails a bit.

Your site in order to attract readers has to offer something to them. Something they want to read. But yes, as an author I might be interested in taking a peek.

Cheers, Greg.

[DRMarvello]

If it's a website where "authors meet other authors", what's in it for me as a reader? 

If it's a website where authors of a particular genre take turns blogging, advertising, taking questions from readers, then maybe. 

Actually, the site is reader-oriented. The main navigation takes you to the Book Sale page and the Author page. The listings are optimized for readers, not authors. My goal was to make it easy to browse the book list, find ones that look interesting, and then drill down for more info.

The author networking happens mostly outside the site, but the site links out to the posts that are created by participating authors. It's sort of a hub for relevant blog posts (relevant to the book or author). For example, the book listings will include links to blog reviews and giveaways. The author listings will include links to interviews and guest posts.

[DRMarvello]

I agree with the others. A site for authors to meet and cross polinate etc is great and all, but other authors are only a small to tiny percentage of your readership. If it was going to work as you want you'd have to drag in some big authors with their own followings and then hang off their coat tails a bit.

Your site in order to attract readers has to offer something to them. Something they want to read. But yes, as an author I might be interested in taking a peek.

Cheers, Greg.

Thanks, Greg. As for attracting a "big" author, I think it will come down to the number of participants I can get. If I can build up a nice selection of books and a good-sized group of authors, more authors may want to have their book listed as well, particularly if it results in sales.

Fighting obscurity was the inspiration, but lets be realistic; the purpose of fighting obscurity is to sell books.

I'll PM you a link so you can see how the site actually IS reader oriented.

[MrPLD]

Author-Author sites to improve readership/reduce-obscurity reminds me a bit of a scene in Futurama (TheFarnsworth Parabox) where two Benders hug each other and then steal each other's wallets.  

Such sites can be wonderful, but I think I'll be skipping and instead heading out to deal with readers more directly, it seems lately we've forgotten that they're the ones to court first; it's just easier to chat with other writers and forget the original focus.

[DRMarvello]

Author-Author sites to improve readership/reduce-obscurity reminds me a bit of a scene in Futurama (TheFarnsworth Parabox) where two Benders hug each other and then steal each other's wallets.  

Such sites can be wonderful, but I think I'll be skipping and instead heading out to deal with readers more directly, it seems lately we've forgotten that they're the ones to court first; it's just easier to chat with other writers and forget the original focus.

Nice Futurama reference!

One of the best things to come out of this entire thread is that I obviously need to be more clear about the fact that the site is mostly about pooling similar books together for the convenience of our readers. What the author networking brings to the table is a depth of additional information about the books and authors that can be hard to discover on other book sites. The author networking supports the function of the site; it isn't the focus.

Most of the sites I've been to, including Amazon.com, make it hard to just browse for books you might be interested in. You get too little information in the product list, and too much information on the product page. Much of the time, it takes three clicks just to see the complete blurb for a book! I'm trying to offer something with a better user experience.

[Elizabeth Ann West]

I think you have a brilliant idea as long as you thing like a reader, not an author. The latest books, the latest news on big sellers in that genre (we usually know more than most readers because of our "connection" I mean blog we stalk...)

Regular blog posts about the genre to get readers talking (the use of mythological names in non-classical imaginings, characters that defy traditional roles such as mage, ranger, etc.) are also good. It will draw people that are passionate about the books to be regular visitors.

I would also reach out to local role-playing guilds and organizations. Maybe leave business cards at the shops (with the owner's permission) etc.

[DRMarvello]

I think you have a brilliant idea as long as you thing like a reader, not an author. The latest books, the latest news on big sellers in that genre (we usually know more than most readers because of our "connection" I mean blog we stalk...)

Regular blog posts about the genre to get readers talking (the use of mythological names in non-classical imaginings, characters that defy traditional roles such as mage, ranger, etc.) are also good. It will draw people that are passionate about the books to be regular visitors.

I would also reach out to local role-playing guilds and organizations. Maybe leave business cards at the shops (with the owner's permission) etc.

Hey, thanks, Elizabeth Ann. Those are some practical and helpful suggestions. I like!