Kinda Shocking

[Elijsha]

"Pew Forum survey, 70 percent of Americans agree with the statement that "many religions can lead to eternal life."

 I'm in, The Way The Truth, an The Life crowd!

[Anju No. 469]

Sorry it is only 70%, but believe it.

[mwvickers]

I'll be honest, I'm not all that shocked. 

[Suzanne]

I'm not shocked either. I would have thought the number to be higher actually.

[Cowgirl]

I actually thought the number would be lower...I think a lot of religions believe only thier religion leads to heaven.

[Suzanne]

I heard from my childhood on an analogy of a wagon wheel. The spokes were the different religions and the hub was God. The sentiment was that all religions lead to God, that just as long as you worship, it all goes to God. This is why I am not surprised by those numbers.

[koolmnbv]

I am not surprised by that number. If I would have been surveyed I would have answered that way.

I don't study or have much knowledge of other religions asides from my own.  But I do believe that if you are living for God and in his good name and in a proper way in your own religion (whatever that may be for you) than it will lead you to the right spot in the end. Good things for good people.

[mwvickers]

I won't explain why I think that the view that "all roads (can) lead to God" is wrong here, as I don't know the rules of the forum on discussing religious issues.  I will, however, explain it to anyone who is interested by pm. 

[koolmnbv]

I won't explain why I think that the view that "all roads (can) lead to God" is wrong here, as I don't know the rules of the forum on discussing religious issues.  I will, however, explain it to anyone who is interested by pm. 

Would this thread not be the place to do that? Im not sure of exact rules either but i think anyone in this area and thread is interested in talking/thinking/hearing about God religion etc.

[mwvickers]

Would this thread not be the place to do that? Im not sure of exact rules either but i think anyone in this area and thread is interested in talking/thinking/hearing about God religion etc.

I would like to think so, but then again, you never know.  LOL

I would think that any thread created for a specific purpose would work, and I've seen threads in other parts of the board that attempted to discuss politics, for example, get "shut down," I think so as to avoid controversy. 

If the mods don't have a problem with it in here, I'll gladly discuss it openly. 

[koolmnbv]

I would like to think so, but then again, you never know.  LOL

I would think that any thread created for a specific purpose would work, and I've seen threads in other parts of the board that attempted to discuss politics, for example, get "shut down," I think so as to avoid controversy. 

If the mods don't have a problem with it in here, I'll gladly discuss it openly. 

I understand what you mean about the other threads. Hopefully a mod can stop by and let us know if its ok to proceed with that type of conversation contained within this thread.

[Suzanne]

Betsy the Quilter is the moderator of this Book Klub. I have asked her to look over this thread and asked her opinion if the discussion is appropriate.

My opinion is that it is appropriate since this is a book klub mainly discussing religion. Of course, we would want to show respect for other people's beliefs in the same fashion that we want respect shown for our beliefs.

[koolmnbv]

Betsy the Quilter is the moderator of this Book Klub. I have asked her to look over this thread and asked her opinion if the discussion is appropriate.

My opinion is that it is appropriate since this is a book klub mainly discussing religion. Of course, we would want to show respect for other people's beliefs in the same fashion that we want respect shown for our beliefs.

Thank you for talking to betsy. I agree I dont want to step on anyones toes with the conversation so it is better to check first.

[Anju No. 469]

I personally don't feel it should be a problem because so few people come here, just the ones that need this thread.  Of course, lots of folks don't go to all the other fun threads, but that is Betsy and the mods and Harvey's call.  It's ok with me.

[mwvickers]

Of course, we would want to show respect for other people's beliefs in the same fashion that we want respect shown for our beliefs.

I agree I dont want to step on anyones toes with the conversation so it is better to check first.

From previous experiences (and knowing the cultural climate we live in) I think this should be clearly spelled out.  In other words, we need to have an up front understanding of what it means to respect other beliefs and not step on toes. 

What I mean is this:  We live in a day when the word "tolerance" has been redefined and "offense" is now the highest moral wrong anyone can commit, or so it seems. 

The word "tolerate" really means that I can get along civilly with someone else, even when we disagree strongly; we can disagree, and we can even express disagreements verbally, but we don't resort to name-calling, bashing, etc.  We can each express that we feel the other person is wrong (shameful word today), but we still get along without killing each other, so to speak. 

The new definition, however, of the word "tolerate" means that I not only treat someone whom I disagree with respectfully, but that I also accept their point of view as true, too.  In other words, under the new definition of tolerance, I should never feel that one person can be right and another wrong.  This is not tolerance, however, by the true definition.

The same thing applies to respecting other people's beliefs.  The new view is that if I say that I think someone is wrong, then I'm not respecting their beliefs.  In reality, however, I believe we can express strong disagreement with another person's viewpoint while still respecting that viewpoint. 

How do I think we show respect?  By being able to dialogue with each other and clearly represent each other's viewpoint.  By listening to one another and understanding one another, even if we end up disagreeing with one another.  In other words, I may think a person is wrong, but if I am respecting that person's beliefs, I do my best to understand those beliefs clearly, to represent them fairly, and to disagree civilly. 

The same goes for stepping on someone's toes and offending that person.  The truth is, it is impossible to go through life without being offended.  Now, I should not purposefully try to offend anyone.  But when discussing something as personal as religion, offenses are sure to come, even if not intended.  This is where tolerance comes back in and being an adult is important.  We may disagree, and that disagreement may come as an offense, but we can still simply acknowledge that we each have different views, relate civilly, and continue to dialogue. 

I hope all of this makes sense.  In my opinion, only by agreeing to the above regarding tolerance and offense can we hope to have a dialogue that may prove beneficial to us all.

Martin

[Suzanne]

I agree, Martin. If I don't agree with another person's beliefs, that does not mean I am an intolerant person. But I can disagree without being disagreeable. It would not be appropriate for me to laugh at their beliefs, mock their beliefs, call them names or just basically, get ugly over the issue.

I have seen in some threads where if the subject matter wasn't going in the direction a particular person wanted it to go, they would hijack the thread into another direction. This has never happened in the One-Year Bible Book Klub thread. But I had seen it happen in other threads and now I simply avoid those areas. I believe that kind of behavior is rude & intolerant.

BTW, back to the subject matter at hand. When I spoke of the analogy I was taught as a child of the wheel and the spokes, I wasn't necessarily saying I bought into that analogy. But if I was taught that as a child, how many other people were taught that? That is why I would have thought the number would have been higher.

[mwvickers]

BTW, back to the subject matter at hand. When I spoke of the analogy I was taught as a child of the wheel and the spokes, I wasn't necessarily saying I bought into that analogy. But if I was taught that as a child, how many other people were taught that? That is why I would have thought the number would have been higher.

You are right.  A similar analogy is villages around a mountain, all taking different paths up to God at the top of the mountain.

There are some assumptions there though that have to be considered.

I'm still kind of holding off until we hear from a moderator.  I don't think there would be problems, here, but I want to be sure first out of respect for the mods.

[Betsy the Quilter]

Sorry for the delay in responding on the request to look this over...I'm travelling and in Finland right now with limited Internet access.  Let me read this and I'll respond as soon as possible...

Betsy

[lynninva]

I agree with Martin & Suzanne that we need to be careful due to the board's guidelines regarding religious and political discussions.  Especially since those discussions can be quite heated. 

In response to the OP, and in a manner that is customary here, I would like to recommend a related book:

   How Good Is Good Enough?

Author: Andy Stanley
Kindle Edition
Price: $7.99

I read this last year in DTV & found it to be an excellent presentation.

[mwvickers]

I agree with Martin & Suzanne that we need to be careful due to the board's guidelines regarding religious and political discussions.  Especially since those discussions can be quite heated. 

In response to the OP, and in a manner that is customary here, I would like to recommend a related book:

   How Good Is Good Enough?

Author: Andy Stanley
Kindle Edition
Price: $7.99

I read this last year in DTV & found it to be an excellent presentation.

Good book to recommend.

Keep in mind, though, that I am not saying we should not have a discussion.  I simply didn't want to start one without approval from a moderator. 

Yes, they can get heated, but it is possible to have a discussion like that without it getting heated. 

Also, strong disagreement is not automatically heated.  It's when people start name-calling and the like that it has become so. 

I think it would probably be okay, as we are in a "religious" section of the board. 

[koolmnbv]

I agree with what has been posted so far and I will also wait until the mods let us know. I can be patient..sometimes 

[Betsy the Quilter]

Hey, y'all, thanks for the patience.

I've read through what you've been posting already, and I think, ultimately, if you think this fits within the boundaries of your book klub, and can keep it as civil as you've been doing, which I fully expect  it should be fine.

If any violent agreement breaks out, let me know!

 

Betsy

[koolmnbv]

Hey, y'all, thanks for the patience.

I've read through what you've been posting already, and I think, ultimately, if you think this fits within the boundaries of your book klub, and can keep it as civil as you've been doing, which I fully expect  it should be fine.

If any violent agreement breaks out, let me know!

 

Betsy

Agreed to on my part. thanks Betsy 

[Elijsha]

"Matt 7" 21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

 That will be the worst feeling you could ever have!

[koolmnbv]

Stuff like That  is what makes me know at times I fall very very short.