Religion in books - does it belong?

[mfstewart]

Hi, everyone, this is a subject near and dear to me and one that I'm very concerned about. I don't want to incite people, and at the heart of it I've written a story of universality; in fact you could argue that 24 Bones reinforces all religion in particular Christianity and Islam. But people may not get to that part.

The first reviewer mentions straight off: "In the world of religion, the argument that Christianity is based on the old Egyptian belief system that harks back to the days of pharoahs is the basis for the intriguing read 24 Bones by talented Michael F. Stewart."

This is a bit simplistic, of course, but I suppose it's true enough that this is part of the book but only part. Revelatory for some, but actually out in the literature (academic and pop) for some time. I did a great deal of research in writing 24 Bones including primary research in Egypt, which really brought it all together (I actually found flaws in the research of some). I've corresponded with the academic world, but kept all but the most relevant detail out of the book so as to not slow down the story.

Fundamentally, however, my question is this - do you think it's okay to appropriate religion (your own or others) for novels? It certainly worked for the Davinci Code. I don't like thrillers that present a one sided view of Islam. I do like insightful material even if it strays into the realm of fiction. I'm interested in religion, it informs a lot of our world's economies and politics, and I think it's worth writing about.

But maybe I'm being overly sensitive, I learned that Ezekiel Code is also very popular and deals with some of the same research material. (haven't read it yet, but sure looks interesting). You tell me?

[J.E.Johnson]

Hey mfstewart,
     I think religion belongs in a book if you want it there.  I happen to be Catholic, but I'm not a very conservative Catholic.  I've read The Da Vinci Code and enjoyed it; I know of several Catholic groups that were both offended and called for a boycott.  If you are interested in religion (and especially if you've done your research) no one should try and keep you from writing about it.  If your aim is to enlighten people about a particular religion (you mentioned Islam), then I give you the thumbs up for it.  I think that America has been ill-informed with regards to that religion and it would be nice to get a more positive view on it.  Furthermore, I agree with your mention of Christianity being based somewhat in the old world religions (I studied Celtic myth and history while in college and the symbolism was so similar to that of Christianity that it had to have been borrowed).  My conclusion: I think any book written with religious themes is going to be attacked by some and hailed by others; don't let that get in your way.  Hope this offers encouragement!
-Jenna

[Lynn ODell]

Religion is a part of life, so of course it belongs in fiction novels.

That's like asking, "Does murder/rape/marriage/sex/divorce or any other topic you can think of belong in a book?"

[mfstewart]

It does J.E.Johnson, I was brought up Catholic and certainly have no basis to dislike it or any other religion for that matter.

For The Caliphate, (I wrote under penname Jack Stewart), I used the Minangkabau people of Sumatra to provide another side of Islam (the book also features the Jemaah Islamiyah) - oddly enough the Minangkabau have a matriarchal culture and I found it a fascinating balance of belief and tradition.

RedAdept, I agree with your list but it's interesting that anything with rape in it is frowned upon by the majority of publishers. I suspect it's because it's often gratuitous if it's written out in scene. The rape itself isn't interesting, its the impact of it.

[Lynn ODell]

I could have added lots and lots of others. Politics is one that comes to mind now and is a better analogy as it, too, is an oft debated topic that can make tempers run hot.

I am a rather eclectic fiction reader and, while I might not be interested in every topic, none are sacred.

[Steph H]

Religion is a part of some people's life, and not a part of others'. Just like a lot of things.  Myself, I'm not particularly religious nor am I anti-religious. That said, I tend not to buy books that have any overt religious theme. But that's just me. I do appreciate it when a book description indicates that it does have such a theme, so I can avoid it.

I don't mind so much sci-fi/fantasy type books that have their own version of religion that's not directly representative of our world's versions of religion, especially when they're only a part of the story and not the main theme. Being a fictional religion, even if only a thinly-disguised parallel to one or more of our own, doesn't bother me as much for some reason... :shrugs: Maybe I feel less like I'm being preached to? :shrugs again:

[vwkitten]

I almost hate to stick my nose in this one but what about the Shack...?

[pidgeon92]

Really, it depends on the story.... As a non-religious person, I do often wonder if what is represented in religion in fiction is factual, particularly in the case of the Dan Brown novels.

Now, Christian fiction, like romances and stuff, does not interest me at all, I cannot relate.

[NAmbrose]

I believe that it is certainly acceptable to include religious or spiritual references in any work that requires them.  Many of the earliest writings and oral traditions refer directly to various religious beliefs and motivations, and we as a species have been molded in many ways by these beliefs.  My only caveat would be that one tries to be accurate when attempting to portray any particular religious faith.  In my latest novel, I did a substantial amount of research before I felt comfortable including references to the medieval Roman Catholic Church as a critical plot element.  It is simply too important to too many people on this planet to do any less, in my opinion.

[Betsy the Quilter]

From my perspective as a reader, like anything else, it belongs in the book if it serves the story.  If it's stuck in there just because the author has an interest or thinks its the "in" thing to do, it will fall flat.

Betsy

[Leslie]

Really, it depends on the story.... As a non-religious person, I do often wonder if what is represented in religion in fiction is factual, particularly in the case of the Dan Brown novels.

Now, Christian fiction, like romances and stuff, does not interest me at all, I cannot relate.

I never even knew there was such a thing as Christian fiction until I came here to KindleBoards and someone started a thread on the topic.

L

[Ann in Arlington]

I never even knew there was such a thing as Christian fiction until I came here to KindleBoards and someone started a thread on the topic.

L

I have read some of it. . . .usually because I bought a book because of the description of the story, and then found it a bit preachy.  I didn't know it was a whole separate genre.

I suppose there are different degrees and I don't mind reference to the folks attending services or exhibiting certain morals explained by the fact that they are following their beliefs/conscience.  Especially if the fact that they are, say, in a church, is an important part of the plot.

But I have learned, personally, to steer away from authors who would basically stop a story for a page or two while a character did a full examination of conscience or spent pages having one character try to convert the other.  By the time I'd get back to the story I'd have half forgotten what was going on.

Anyway, I agree with Betsy's comment.  And, I would add, you better know what you're talking about.  If you're going to talk about any given belief system, you better have your facts straight.  I have read books where the author clearly did only a cursory amount of research and got some basic facts about major religions completely wrong.  That annoys the heck out of me.

I do like books that take something we only know a few basic facts about and weave a more complete story.  Some of the recent books about biblical figures have done this and, if well done, they can be very good at making you think about what it must have been like then and why people acted as they did.  Which, in turn, will help inform your personal beliefs. 

I kind of think it's best if people are exposed to all sorts of beliefs, cultures, and 'thought' systems so as to best figure out what works for themselves.  But I don't want anyone to say their way is right and mine is wrong!

Oops! Now I'm getting preachy. . . so I'll stop. 

[marianneg]

If you write a book that is religious in nature, that will appeal to some people.  If you write a book that treats religion with contempt, that will appeal to some other people.  If you write a book that says one religion is right and another is wrong, that will appeal to some.  If you're asking if you can involve religion in your book and not offend anyone, then the answer is probably no.

[LisaW.]

From my perspective as a reader, like anything else, it belongs in the book if it serves the story.  If it's stuck in there just because the author has an interest or thinks its the "in" thing to do, it will fall flat.

Betsy

I totally agree with this. I've read scifi & fantasy where a form of religion may be completely from the author's imagination, or seem based on a particular religion. But as long as the author isn't trying to make a point about what religion is right or wrong, or preach to the reader, then I have no problem with it.

What I don't like is if a book has a large amount of religion in it, but there was nothing in the book description to tell me this.

[pidgeon92]

I never even knew there was such a thing as Christian fiction until I came here to KindleBoards and someone started a thread on the topic.

I went on a cruise a few years ago, and picked up several books at the library to tide me over, including what looked like a good chick lit series.... I think there were 4 or 5 paperbacks.... I got a chapter into the first one, and there were several references to finding a Christian boyfriend.... I looked at the back of the book and found it was published by a Christian-only publisher.... I've been careful to check for this in other novels I pick up.

[EllenR]

I actually love books that present religion in a historic light and seek to educate as well as entertain. For me personally, I have no issues with religion in books unless it is purely Christian fiction, which I dislike and have previously found very boring. I am a Catholic myself but prefer to learn about all religions. I like books that are thought provoking and perhaps even disturb my sense of status quo on religion. There have been a number of books that made my go out and do research into a previously unknown religious concept or historic trail (gnostic gospels, pagan rites, etc.) or even pick up my bible to see what they referenced in context.

Basically, if an author wants to make religion part of their book that is their right. There is no way everyone is going to like every topic anyway. C'est la vie!

EllenR

[mfstewart]

Thanks everyone for your comments. It gives me a lot more confidence in marketing 24 Bones, which has its share of religious intrigue.

EllenR - did you mean The Pagan Christ by Tom Harpur, or is Pagan Rites another book I should pick up? I've read a lot by Elaine Pagels and believe it or not actually read all of the Gnostic Gospels although they don't feature in 24 Bones.

MFS

[telracs]

MFS-

To paraphrase a well known quote, "you can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time."  As long as you, as the author are pleased, then the religion contained in your books shouldn't be an issue.  People not interested in the religions portrayed will hopefully just not buy your book.

[EllenR]

MFS, neither of those books have come into my TBR list but may now, thanks to you. LOL

More often I come across a reference to something (like pagan beliefs) in the course of fiction books I read and want to know more. Religion in general is a topic that I find very interesting. I am particularly interested in the origin of Christianity as it relates to prior religions. There is some much that I don't know and I find the topic very thought-provoking.

I think you should trust your gut about your own book. If it interested you, it will likely interest others. Don't worry about whether the religious aspect will turn some people off. Look at how much interest the DaVinci Code generated. As mentioned, not all of it was positive. You can't let concern about that stop you (easy for me to say, I know!). 

Just remember, there are plenty of people who find these topics interesting. One of my favorite books, Boyd Morrison's The Ark is based on religious intrigue and provided a whole new approach to a time-honored tenet of Christianity.  It certainly hasn't seemed to hurt him!

EllenR

[mfstewart]

EllenR, check out http://www.aprildeconick.com/ She's a leading researcher in this area. I've heard her speak. She has a very different take on Gospel of Judas that was uncovered awhile back and created quite a controversy.

[Rasputina]

I tend to feel it's the readers responsibility to not take any fiction books portrayal of religion as factually true but to do their own research. I enjoyed Dan Browns book as fantasy entertainment at the same time I was rolling my eyes at the people I knew that were treating it as factually true.  Although I'll admit that some writers take this past my comfort zone with their attempts to further their own agenda and to try to incite others.

[EllenR]

EllenR, check out http://www.aprildeconick.com/ She's a leading researcher in this area. I've heard her speak. She has a very different take on Gospel of Judas that was uncovered awhile back and created quite a controversy.

I will, thanks.

[William Woodall]

I think there's nothing wrong with including religious material if it suits the story you're telling and if it's an integral part of the plot.  I hate it when authors have an obvious axe to grind and use their story as a vehicle for propaganda, but that can also happen with politics or social views or any number of things besides just religion.

At times I've included Christian themes as an aspect of some of my stories, although not in a preachy or obnoxious way.  Only when that was the kind of story I was actually telling.  As I said, I dislike it when a story is used as a tool for propaganda, so I'd be hypocritical if I then went and did exactly the thing I so thoroughly despise in other books. 

That said, I don't think it's unusual or inappropriate for a character to discuss how he came to believe certain things and how it affected his life after he did. . . if that's important to the story.  One of my books turned out like that.  The main character did some soul searching because of totally unrelated things that were causing him a lot of grief at the time, and in so doing he found his way to God.  That's a realistic portrayal of something that happens very frequently in real life.  Since the book was all about the way the main character struggled with his inner conflicts and the way he resolved those struggles, it was appropriate to include religion in that context.  It mattered to the story that was being told.

Of course, as others have said, there will always be people who are offended by anything you say about religion, no matter what you say or what viewpoint you take or how integral to the story it may be.  That can't be helped.  Write the story you want to tell and don't shy away from discussing whatever needs to be discussed.  Then let the chips fall where they may.


 

[mfstewart]

Coincidentally I was listening to the CBC today (Canada public radio) and they were interviewing Salman Rushdie and he brought up religion, and how even being a devote atheist he couldn't resist as a writer bringing religion into his books. He called them concentrated narratives that are very powerful and can't be ignored.