An Echo in the Bone: Discuss Part One here

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Part One:  A Troubling of the Waters

1.  Sometimes they're really dead.

2.  And sometimes they aren't

3.  Life for life

4.  Not yet awhile

5.  Morality for time travelers

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

If it weren't for the title of the first chapter, sometimes they're really dead, I would almost think Bonnet was alive with all the fuss made over him. 

I'm glad we got to see the full scene between Bree and Willie. 

Isn't it nice that Bobby and Amy are married?

At least John Grey acknowledges Roger as a "remarkable man, having not only survived marriage to that fabulous creature but actually having sired children upon her."  I figure that's DG responding to many fans complaining about Roger's treatment.  We can't be the only people unhappy with that.

I'm not sure I understand what's going on with John Grey and Willie.  Why is he stopping Willie from being recalled to England?  If he doesn't want to lose him, he can return to England himself.  Why is he sending him to Howe in the north where the pot is bubbling over and it's most dangerous?

A man named "Beauchamp" waiting for John?  That kind of surprised me.  I don't think John ever knew Claire's maiden name.  He only knew her as Claire Fraser.  I wonder if that's going to be significant later, even though it's only a code name. 

Percy (obviously and old lover) tries to offer his condolences to John on the loss of his wife.  Once again, John stops all talk of Isabelle.  There's got to be something behind that and I hope we'll find out soon. 

Obviously, Percy is talking about turning Benedict Arnold.  Funny that Grey will be mixed up in that. 

There goes Claire again.  Jamie tells her to bolt the door.  Does she?  No, of course not.  She's got to go outside for a breath of air.  Then she's thinking about leaving the door open for hours to let out Grannie MacLeod's soul.  Sheesh. 

I figured it was Murdina and not Arch that Ian shot.  Murderous old witch.  I know she was like a grandmother to Ian and cared for everyone in the family, but all the time, she was stealing the stolen gold with Arch and murdered Lionel Brown, not to save Claire, but to cover up their crime.  Honestly, I liked the old gal, but after everything she and Arch got up to, I didn't feel bad.  I felt bad for Ian, Jamie and Claire, but not for Murdina and Arch.

Ian is taking it awfully hard, and I can understand that, but no one has mentioned to him or anyone else, that she was going to kill Jamie.  Had, in fact, wounded him.  Ian was saving Jamie's life. 

Ian brought up the man he killed in Edinburgh and how Jamie helped him get over it.  I guess Claire never got around to telling him that the guy was alive and well on The Porpoise when she was there.  Of course, he was drowned in the hurricane, but that had nothing to do with Ian.

So, Aidan has cousins.  Where was the family when he and Amy and the baby needed help?

Isn't it interesting that after Arch's grand speech about the gold belonging to Charles Stuart, he used it to make a gold brooch for his wife.  I think he intended to keep the gold for himself all along. 

I guess the only way Ian could expiate his guilt was to offer his life to Arch and I think he meant to allow Arch to do it.  How sinister is it that Arch said "When you've something worth taking, boy -- you'll see me again."  Quite scary.  I think he'll follow them wherever they go, even back to Scotland, and he'll watch and wait.  (shudder)

Wow, I didn't think of Mandy and Jem one day accidentally, or maybe on purpose, walking through the stones.  How do you explain that to kids?  Bree and Roger have their work cut out for them with that. 

I knew Jem would remember.  Those nightmares.  They better decided what to tell him now.  Mandy may even remember on some subconscious level. 

Roger might some day be ordained, but only if he can reconcile himself to the lives he had to take in the past.  I've been thinking about that.  If Roger had been an American in that time period, he might have been drafted and sent to VietNam where he would have to do the same things or worse.  Just because we know now that England hasn't been invaded in the 1970's doesn't mean that any country could not be invaded at any time and someone like Roger will have to defend home and country.  Those circumstances could always occur, any time, any place.

I don't remember any place with a Spaniard.  I think Bree and Roger should ask Jem now if Grandda ever took him someplace where there was a Spaniard.  He might still remember, but 10 years down the road, he might not. 

Roger wants to be back in the 18th century to fight by Jamie's side.  I think he's having  trouble adjusting to his own time.  I think he's a very conflicted, complicated man.

[Luvmy4brats]

I didn't reread the last two books and it's been so long. I think I may have to stop reading this one and go back and do a quick reread of them before I go any further. I think I've forgotten way too much.

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

I didn't reread the last two books and it's been so long. I think I may have to stop reading this one and go back and do a quick reread of them before I go any further. I think I've forgotten way too much.

For a quick refresher, you might want to read our discussions of the last two books instead of rereading them.  Just a suggestion.

[melissaj323]

Gertie, I enjoyed reading your thoughts on part one. You actually picked up on a few things that I had missed....for example the man "Beauchamp" with that being Claire's maiden name......I think I am going to take your suggestion about re-reading some of the past discussions for the previous books. It has been about 2 years since I read a Breath of Snow and Ashes and I am having a hard remembering what has happened to them in the past......ugh!! I wish there was a list of characters in the book to refresh my memory! (maybe i need to buy the Outlandish companion)! Even though I am having trouble remembering, i am still enjoying the book. Man, i love Jamie!!!

[CegAbq]

Also - maybe Wikipedia's short recaps might help as a refresher:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diana_Gabaldon#Outlander_Series

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Gertie, I enjoyed reading your thoughts on part one. You actually picked up on a few things that I had missed....for example the man "Beauchamp" with that being Claire's maiden name......

There are coincidences piled on coincidences, so everything I'm reading, I'm pondering over.  Some things I remember, others, I have to stop and think.  Does the name "Willie Coulter" mean anything to you?  It just came up and I was amazed that I remembered it.  Every name, every incident seems to refer back to past books. 

I think I am going to take your suggestion about re-reading some of the past discussions for the previous books. It has been about 2 years since I read a Breath of Snow and Ashes and I am having a hard remembering what has happened to them in the past......ugh!! I wish there was a list of characters in the book to refresh my memory! (maybe i need to buy the Outlandish companion)! Even though I am having trouble remembering, i am still enjoying the book. Man, i love Jamie!!!

The Outlandish Companion only goes through book 4 and most people haven't liked the Companion. 

Glad you're enjoying the book.  Now that I know someone else is reading it, I'll catch up with posting my thoughts.

[millie34]

I think Diana's device of using the letters to link the past and the present is great.  I also admire Bree's and Roger's restraint.  I can't imagine not reading them all.

You're right Gertie, doesn't Ian know the difference between murder and self-defense.  But he'll always have to be looking over his shoulder, at least until Arch is dead.

I can't wait for him to be reunited with Jenny and Big Ian.

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

I think Diana's device of using the letters to link the past and the present is great.  I also admire Bree's and Roger's restraint.  I can't imagine not reading them all.

The letters are wonderful.  I know I would have read them all at once. 

You're right Gertie, doesn't Ian know the difference between murder and self-defense.  But he'll always have to be looking over his shoulder, at least until Arch is dead.

Arch has got to be following him.  With the revolution, what would be easier than cutting Ian down in battle.  On the other hand, maybe he'll think that would be too honorable a death.

I can't wait for him to be reunited with Jenny and Big Ian.

I can see Jenny smacking him upside the head first and then hugging him till his ribs crack.

[CegAbq]

Ok - still haven't broken down & bought Echo; but I read back through the question lists for ABOSAA & realize that I too have forgotten so much, that while waiting for the price decline, I'm going to need to go back and try to speed read ABOSAA!
Wow.

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Ok - still haven't broken down & bought Echo; but I read back through the question lists for ABOSAA & realize that I too have forgotten so much, that while waiting for the price decline, I'm going to need to go back and try to speed read ABOSAA!
Wow.

I think DG has included stuff from all the books. 

[CegAbq]

I think DG has included stuff from all the books. 

Great! - so I should have been speed reading all summer! LOL

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Great! - so I should have been speed reading all summer! LOL

See, you should have been reading along with the book klub since December. 

Hopefully, I'm covering all of the references in my posts, so that might help. 

Just think, we get to do this again in four years when the last one comes out.   

[millie34]

The Outlandish Companion only goes through book 4 and most people haven't liked the Companion. 

I thought the Outlandish Companion was great, I almost read it cover to cover.  My one complaint was regarding the list of foreign phrases.  They should have been in alphabetical order.  Everytime I want to look something up I have to go through the whole list.

[PraiseGod13]

I just finished reading Part One and there seem to be a lot of questions plaguing me.  The use of the Beauchamp name.... and I agree.... what's with Lord John sending Willie into the thick of danger??  And, I agree with you Gertie on so many things..... why are they not telling Ian that he probably saved Jamie's life when Mrs. Bug was ready to fire the second gun at Jamie?  She might have been a good cook... but she was a murdering thief too.  I wasn't happy in ABOSOA when Jamie just let Arch Bug saunter off.... and now Arch threatens Ian and they just let him wander away again??  Jamie is always the defender of family...... why in the world didn't he tell Arch that he'd better not even think about hurting a hair on Ian's head??
     I thought it was strange that Amy all of a sudden has family when there was no one to help her earlier..... but I'm so happy she married Bobby and I love the relationship he's developing with her children as their stepfather.
     I wracked my brain trying to remember Jem, Jamie, and a Spaniard reference but I couldn't come up with anything.  Eventually, I even did a Kindle search for Spaniard but the only references it gave me were in Echo.  So maybe this is the first we've heard about it???
     I, too, really like how DG used the letters that Claire and Jamie wrote to Bree and family.  A big part of me would want to read all of them immediately.... but I can totally relate to Bree wanting to not finish them to keep her parents "alive" for a little while longer.  I know it's not the same, but it's a little like how I feel with these books.... I'm so eager to read them..... but at the same time.... I don't want them to be over.  And, it brings back the feelings I always have when I see my mom's handwriting.  She's been dead for 15 years now, and seeing her handwriting still touches me like few things can.  So, as I read this, I knew how Bree and Roger would be feeling as they saw Jamie and Claire's familiar handwriting and I'm so glad DG wrote this this way.
     Roger definitely has "issues" to work through.  I don't think he's sure where he belongs yet.  With Bree, obviously, but part of him longs for them to be with Jamie & Claire too.  I think he & Jamie were finally starting to develop a strong relationship before Roger and Bree and kids needed to leave.  Roger didn't really have the skills needed to thrive in the 1700's..... and now he's going to need to find his place as a man with a family who has returned back to the 1900's.  With living at Lallybroch, it's not looking like he intends to return to university teaching so maybe he's planning on pursuing his ministerial ambitions.
     What a continuing adventure we've started on here..... and it's going to be 4 years before there's more??  I can't imagine needing to wait that long..... but I also can't imagine that it will be the final one.......

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

At last, someone to talk to.   

I just finished reading Part One and there seem to be a lot of questions plaguing me.  The use of the Beauchamp name.... and I agree.... what's with Lord John sending Willie into the thick of danger?? 

Apparently, Percy Beauchamp appears in one of the Lord John books.  I read one of them, didn't like it at all, and I still have no desire to read them.  Without spoiling, enough is said throughout the book that you can piece it together. 

And, I agree with you Gertie on so many things..... why are they not telling Ian that he probably saved Jamie's life when Mrs. Bug was ready to fire the second gun at Jamie?  She might have been a good cook... but she was a murdering thief too.  I wasn't happy in ABOSOA when Jamie just let Arch Bug saunter off.... and now Arch threatens Ian and they just let him wander away again??  Jamie is always the defender of family...... why in the world didn't he tell Arch that he'd better not even think about hurting a hair on Ian's head??

I guess they were all pretty conflicted about Mrs. Bug.  Still, knowing what they already knew about the Bugs, it should have been easier to come to terms with her death.  I can see Ian being upset, but you're right, Jamie is always defending family and he should have stepped in. 

     I thought it was strange that Amy all of a sudden has family when there was no one to help her earlier..... but I'm so happy she married Bobby and I love the relationship he's developing with her children as their stepfather.

Yes, that was very nice.  Bobby isn't a very strong person, and I can't see him becoming a leader, but at least he'll take care of Jamie's farm.

     I wracked my brain trying to remember Jem, Jamie, and a Spaniard reference but I couldn't come up with anything.  Eventually, I even did a Kindle search for Spaniard but the only references it gave me were in Echo.  So maybe this is the first we've heard about it???

I think it is the first time we've heard of it.  At some point, maybe Roger and Bree will ask Jem.

     I, too, really like how DG used the letters that Claire and Jamie wrote to Bree and family.  A big part of me would want to read all of them immediately.... but I can totally relate to Bree wanting to not finish them to keep her parents "alive" for a little while longer.  I know it's not the same, but it's a little like how I feel with these books.... I'm so eager to read them..... but at the same time.... I don't want them to be over.  And, it brings back the feelings I always have when I see my mom's handwriting.  She's been dead for 15 years now, and seeing her handwriting still touches me like few things can.  So, as I read this, I knew how Bree and Roger would be feeling as they saw Jamie and Claire's familiar handwriting and I'm so glad DG wrote this this way.

I really liked those parts.  It made me feel closer to Jamie and Claire, too.

     Roger definitely has "issues" to work through.  I don't think he's sure where he belongs yet.  With Bree, obviously, but part of him longs for them to be with Jamie & Claire too.  I think he & Jamie were finally starting to develop a strong relationship before Roger and Bree and kids needed to leave.  Roger didn't really have the skills needed to thrive in the 1700's..... and now he's going to need to find his place as a man with a family who has returned back to the 1900's.  With living at Lallybroch, it's not looking like he intends to return to university teaching so maybe he's planning on pursuing his ministerial ambitions.

Roger's a good guy and a family man.  I'm not sure where he's headed, even though I've read the whole book.  He and Bree certainly have an uneven relationship.

     What a continuing adventure we've started on here..... and it's going to be 4 years before there's more??  I can't imagine needing to wait that long..... but I also can't imagine that it will be the final one.......

Originally, there were supposed to be five books.  Then she increased it to eight, so I think that will be the end.  Honestly, as much as I love Jamie and Claire, I'm ready for the next one to be the last one.  I want her to start on the Maitre Raymond series.  Hopefully, it will be better than the Lord John series.

[PraiseGod13]

I don't see Bobby being a leader either.  One thing I thought of as I was reading about Bobby in Part One was that Amy's children are giving him something he badly needs.... acceptance simply for who he is.  With his "brand", he has always had to deal with adults judging him even before they got to know him.  But that "brand" means nothing to the children.... they're loving him because of the person he is.
     I'm still really bothered about why Jamie did nothing about Arch Bug threatening Ian.  Jamie would never let anyone threaten his family and then just walk away.  Jamie traveled half way around the world to get Ian back from his kidnappers..... I just don't see him standing there while someone seriously threatens Ian.  Obviously, it's going to keep us on the edge of our seats as part of the story line..... but it just seems too "out-of-character" for Jamie to sit right with me.  The same is true of the aftermath of Mrs. Bugs' death....... she had her good qualities.... but she was also a thief and had shot Jamie and was trying to shoot him a second time when Ian had to kill her (not knowing it was even her).  I just don't think everyone's reactions to her death reflected that.  Very saddened, yes.......  devastated, no.  Just MHO........

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Let's not forget that Murdina Bug also murdered Lionel Brown in cold blood to protect their secret.  He might have been a wicked person, but he was helpless with a broken leg and she smothered him without a second thought.  Claire tried to stop her, but she even shoved Claire aside.

We can only guess at what other atrocities she and Arch got up to in the years before they came to the Ridge. 

I just noticed the similarity between her name and what she did.  Murdina ... murderer.

[PraiseGod13]

Let's not forget that Murdina Bug also murdered Lionel Brown in cold blood to protect their secret.  He might have been a wicked person, but he was helpless with a broken leg and she smothered him without a second thought.  Claire tried to stop her, but she even shoved Claire aside.

We can only guess at what other atrocities she and Arch got up to in the years before they came to the Ridge.  

I just noticed the similarity between her name and what she did.  Murdina ... murderer.

OOHHHH!!  Excellent thought, Gertie.  I had already forgotten her murdering Lionel!!  I read a lot of murder mysteries/crime books and they always say that murdering with your bare hands  ie: strangulation/smothering takes much more "blackness of heart" than, say, just shooting someone with a gun from a distance.  Plus, she and Claire had a pretty good knock-down-drag-out when Claire tried to stop her from killing Lionel.  Claire actually had much more reason to despise Lionel personally and yet she was trying to save him.  Bad Murdina, bad bad Murdina!!!  And then, she shot Jamie.  Guns back then weren't that accurate so she had to be close enough to him to hit him..... so I would think she knew very well that it was Jamie she was shooting at.  Pretty hard not to recognize him by his height and size - especially at close range!!

[imallbs]

I picked up the sample of Echo to go ahead and read the 1st three chapters, then wait to buy the book...yeah, that worked  .  So now I've finished part one.

I agree it was nice to see the full scene between Bree and Willie (I mean William).  I'm also enjoying the additional stuff on Lord John.  But there are getting to be too many characters for me.  I'm afraid it will take too much away from the core story.

The letters are wonderful.  When I read the end of the last book, the line from Jamie's letter, I was thrilled that I didn't have to wait to start reading more of them.  And now Bree is making me wait. 

I got a perverse pleasure out of the description of the the disappearance of Bonnet's body.  Just sayin, hated the guy, glad he's dead, too bad Bree made it easier on him.

Hmmm, Willie and the ladies.  Reminiscent of Jamie in Outlander.  Does Willie have a Laoghaire in his future?

I'm not sure I understand what's going on with John Grey and Willie.  Why is he stopping Willie from being recalled to England?  If he doesn't want to lose him, he can return to England himself.  Why is he sending him to Howe in the north where the pot is bubbling over and it's most dangerous?

The devil you know verses the devil you don't know?  How bad can the alternative be though?  Maybe John does not believe this will be a long, drawn out war.

I liked Roger's reaction to Bree and Claire providing the means for the house to burn down.  But this makes me think about the whole time travel thing – Not going there.
Bobby and Amy sitting in a tree...I'm glad Bobby got his wife. 

I can't imagine what it must smell like in that cabin!  I assume Amy and Bobby were living there because Amy was working at the big house but wouldn't Bobby want his own piece of land and doesn't Amy have some land?  And wouldn't that land now be Bobby's?

There goes Claire again.  Jamie tells her to bolt the door

Wouldn't it just be smarter of Jamie to say “Make sure you leave the door open Sassenach, it's good for ye.  It'll clear the lungs aye!”  She would have been sure to close and bolt the door after a statement like that.

So finally the attacks on the pig make sense.  I figured it was Mrs Bug instead of Arch in the ruins of the house.  Arch is much more likely to take revenge so he would probably stay alive.  And the way every body is acting about the death of that murderous old witch they probably would have taken her into the cabin with them.  I get that every body loved Mrs Bug.  She and Arch showed that they cared for Jamie, Claire and Ian as well.  But nothing trumps the gold for the Bugs.
Finally, at the funeral, some sense from one of our players   “Did it not occur to any of them that Mrs. Bug had something to do with this herself?  Had she not fired at Jamie” YES!  She did, come on people, get a grip.

"When you've something worth taking, boy---you'll see me again”  Chilling.  I think Arch will let Ian live and try to kill his family.  Not Jamie or Claire, he'll wait until Ian is married.  The though of Ian finding some happiness is nice.

Ian brought up the man he killed in Edinburgh and how Jamie helped him get over it.

I choose to read that as “when I thought I killed that man in Edinburgh”

This part left me with lots of questions mostly about Bree and Roger.  I think Bree would have an easier time fitting back in.  I don't think she ever really surrendered to the 18th century but Roger did.  What is he going to do now?   He can't just step back into his life a an historian.  He could write a book but it would have to be presented as fiction.  Why not, Caleb Carr wrote some fiction books.  Roger could always write a book called Outlander.  He can try to become ordained as a minister.  He will probably have some difficulty figuring out what he wants (needs?) to do.

I case you can't tell, I find Roger much more interesting than Bree.  For some reason, I always pictured Theodore Roosevelt when reading about Roger (completely wrong, height, looks, everything).  I have no idea where that came from.  I have now decided to picture Roger like this
  and I'm picturing Ian like this

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

I agree it was nice to see the full scene between Bree and Willie (I mean William).  I'm also enjoying the additional stuff on Lord John.  But there are getting to be too many characters for me.  I'm afraid it will take too much away from the core story.

I agree.  It does take away from the core story.  If you have ever read a Lord John book, you'll see that DG has essentially included a LJ book in this one with his activities as a spy.

The devil you know verses the devil you don't know?  How bad can the alternative be though?  Maybe John does not believe this will be a long, drawn out war.

And he might also feel that William's chances of advancement are better with Howe.

I can't imagine what it must smell like in that cabin!  I assume Amy and Bobby were living there because Amy was working at the big house but wouldn't Bobby want his own piece of land and doesn't Amy have some land?  And wouldn't that land now be Bobby's?

Yes, Amy's land would be Bobby's, but they both have a lot of loyalty to Jamie.  Isn't he now Jamie's factor in the "absence" of Arch and Roger?

Wouldn't it just be smarter of Jamie to say “Make sure you leave the door open Sassenach, it's good for ye.  It'll clear the lungs aye!”  She would have been sure to close and bolt the door after a statement like that.

    When will he learn.

I case you can't tell, I find Roger much more interesting than Bree.  For some reason, I always pictured Theodore Roosevelt when reading about Roger (completely wrong, height, looks, everything).  I have no idea where that came from.  I have now decided to picture Roger like this
  and I'm picturing Ian like this

Good Roger and Ian.  I've been picturing Ian as



And at least he's 6'3"

[tlshaw *Padded Cell 511*]

I finally got the chance to start reading Echo, and just finished Part 1, so here goes.

I would definitely want to read all of the letters at once, but I can also understand Bree wanting to draw it out. I loved reading the parts where Bree is reading the letter, and where Claire and Jamie are writing it. But, I don't remember anything about a Spaniard, so I am anxious for Roger and Bree to ask Jem. You know at some point they will.

When Lord John was going up to meet with Beauchamp, I kept thinking he had to be an ancestor of Claire's. I don't like Percy. He seems to enjoy tormenting John, and over all, I like Lord John. I would have never thought he would be a spy.

I seem to remember some earlier discussions about whether William was gay, but I see that that notion is dispelled in the first chapter. But, doesn't it seem odd that neither William or his friends have noticed the resemblence between him and Bree?

The Bugs - what a pair. I agree with what has already been said regarding Arch and Ian. I hate to think that Ian will have to live the rest of his life looking over his shoulder. At some point, I see a showdown between Arch and Jamie.

I like this look for Roger. He is one of my favorites after Jamie and Claire, of course.
 

I

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

I finally got the chance to start reading Echo, and just finished Part 1, so here goes.

Glad you could finally start the book. 

When Lord John was going up to meet with Beauchamp, I kept thinking he had to be an ancestor of Claire's. I don't like Percy. He seems to enjoy tormenting John, and over all, I like Lord John. I would have never thought he would be a spy.

Did you read any of the LJ books?  I read Lord John and the Private Matter, which was kind of a mystery with John moving through this shadow world (not time travel or anything).  I think I'm going to have to force myself to read it again.  Ugh.  And it's a dtb, too. 

I seem to remember some earlier discussions about whether William was gay, but I see that that notion is dispelled in the first chapter. But, doesn't it seem odd that neither William or his friends have noticed the resemblence between him and Bree?

I think they were just too busy looking at Bree as a potential conquest. 

The Bugs - what a pair. I agree with what has already been said regarding Arch and Ian. I hate to think that Ian will have to live the rest of his life looking over his shoulder. At some point, I see a showdown between Arch and Jamie.

Jamie has had the opportunity to confront Arch twice.  The first time was when he discovered him with the gold and the second was at the funeral.  He didn't then, and I don't think he will, which is surprising.  Not like Jamie at all.  On the other hand in Breath, he did stand aside to let Roger deal with Bonnet.  He'll probably let Ian handle it.  He certainly recognizes that Ian is a man capable of facing his own problems. 

Just had a thought.  I wonder if Jamie knows that Ian killed Allen Christie. 

[NessaBug]

And, I agree with you Gertie on so many things..... why are they not telling Ian that he probably saved Jamie's life when Mrs. Bug was ready to fire the second gun at Jamie?  She might have been a good cook... but she was a murdering thief too.  I wasn't happy in ABOSOA when Jamie just let Arch Bug saunter off.... and now Arch threatens Ian and they just let him wander away again??  Jamie is always the defender of family...... why in the world didn't he tell Arch that he'd better not even think about hurting a hair on Ian's head??

I guess they were all pretty conflicted about Mrs. Bug.  Still, knowing what they already knew about the Bugs, it should have been easier to come to terms with her death.  I can see Ian being upset, but you're right, Jamie is always defending family and he should have stepped in. 

Just quick thought: when Arch threatened Ian, I feel like Jamie was staying out of it so Ian can fight his own battles. If it comes down to it, Jamie will take care of it. Jamie is always saying things about being a man and letting people be me, and he knew Ian needed to feel a bit of this guilt. And Jamie knows he won't be around forever. (sobs)

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

Just quick thought: when Arch threatened Ian, I feel like Jamie was staying out of it so Ian can fight his own battles. If it comes down to it, Jamie will take care of it. Jamie is always saying things about being a man and letting people be me, and he knew Ian needed to feel a bit of this guilt. And Jamie knows he won't be around forever. (sobs) 

That's pretty much what I said above. 

Jamie has had the opportunity to confront Arch twice.  The first time was when he discovered him with the gold and the second was at the funeral.  He didn't then, and I don't think he will, which is surprising.  Not like Jamie at all.  On the other hand in Breath, he did stand aside to let Roger deal with Bonnet.  He'll probably let Ian handle it.  He certainly recognizes that Ian is a man capable of facing his own problems. 

You didn't have to say Jamie won't be around forever.      Now you've got me crying, too. 

[tlshaw *Padded Cell 511*]

Just quick thought: when Arch threatened Ian, I feel like Jamie was staying out of it so Ian can fight his own battles. If it comes down to it, Jamie will take care of it. Jamie is always saying things about being a man and letting people be me, and he knew Ian needed to feel a bit of this guilt. And Jamie knows he won't be around forever. (sobs)

I tend to agree with this. However, it it came to an actual fight, I think Jamie would jump in if he felt he needed to to protect Ian.

[Gertie Kindle 'a/k/a Margaret Lake']

I tend to agree with this. However, it it came to an actual fight, I think Jamie would jump in if he felt he needed to to protect Ian.

Yes, he definitely would do that.