Kindle Evangelizing! Seems there is a lot of misinformation out there!

[CrystalStarr]

Three days a week I sit at my boys Karate school for about an hour each time.  These days I'm pretty much always bringing either my Kindle Touch or my Kindle Fire.  Before that it was my Kindle Keyboard and before that it was magazines or my whatever.  Until recently no one ever commented.  But it being the holiday season I'm starting to get lots of questions.  I keep running into the same misinformation.  Lots of people seem to think Kindles come preloaded with books and that's all you get and you can't get any more.  Obviously these people also have no idea how many free and extra cheap books there are to be had.  Even those who realize you need to buy books to put on the thing are surprised.  They all seem to think ALL books are $9.99. 

Seems I'm giving people nice surprises.  There might be a few kindles under the tree this Christmas for some Karate students in my area. 

But I'm fascinated by these ideas that so many seem to have.  Where is this coming from?

Oh, and everyone's favorite question... why'd you choose Kindle over the Barnes and Noble one (if we are talking about the Touch) or over the iPad (if we talking about the Fire).  I'll be honest, I don't have good answers to these.  I end up saying something about trusting Amazon will be around longer than Barnes and Noble and like how Amazon's website and shopping works.  And in the case of the iPad question... because it was lots cheaper and works great for me!

[history_lover]

Even those who realize you need to buy books to put on the thing are surprised.  They all seem to think ALL books are $9.99. 

Well, they used to be. Before the agency pricing model, Amazon capped all their ebooks (or at least most of them I think) at $9.99. So while this is outdated info, it's understandable where it's come from.

The biggest misunderstanding I come across (on other forums, I don't normally read my Kindle outside the house, I have my iPhone for that) is people who are "anti-ereader" and don't understand what eInk is. They usually say something like "I read to get AWAY from a computer screen". They can't grasp the idea that eInk screens look nothing like a computer screen and aren't much different from paper and ink.

I've also seen people claim that ereaders are only for casual readers and that "real" or heavy readers aren't interested in them. 

Oh, and everyone's favorite question... why'd you choose Kindle over the Barnes and Noble one (if we are talking about the Touch) or over the iPad (if we talking about the Fire).  I'll be honest, I don't have good answers to these.  I end up saying something about trusting Amazon will be around longer than Barnes and Noble and like how Amazon's website and shopping works.  And in the case of the iPad question... because it was lots cheaper and works great for me!

I'm in the UK so Nook wasn't an option for me. But even had I been in the US, I would have gotten a Kindle - Amazon customer support is better, they have more titles, more promo deals, and now they have more options of models to choose from. I also find their website easier to use/browse and there are third party websites like www.ereaderiq.com for Kindle books which are very useful in many ways whereas I don't know of anything like this for Nookbooks.

[Ann in Arlington]

I was in a training session yesterday and discussing the Kindle at the break. . .mostly it was general information. . .the person in question already knew I had one and had talked to me before about getting one for her husband.  She just wanted some more details on certain things.  She ended up getting him a Keyboard model at Staples, I think, but is seriously considering getting herself one as well. . .she wanted to know about sharing books.

[Annie]

People ask me what the big thing I lug around is because it's not an iPad. Haha. I chose the Kindle, simply because their books are cheaper. I also like that they have Whispernet and their CS is excellent. It was all very enticing. But, I find amusement in walking into B&N and having them approach me to try to sell me the Nook. After they finish their spiel, I simply tell them I have a Kindle. They never understand why I stand there listening to them talk about it, if I already have an e-Reader. I just tell them that it reaffirms my decision.

[dbeman]

I'm in the UK so Nook wasn't an option for me. But even had I been in the US, I would have gotten a Kindle - Amazon customer support is better, they have more titles, more promo deals, and now they have more options of models to choose from.

Just out of curiosity (since the term "misinformation" is used in the subject line) what evidence are you using to conclude that Amazon's customer service is better if you live in the UK? Have you had personal experiences with B&N customer support, or are you relying on what has been said/posted by others?

[Hadou]

Why did I choose Kindle over Nook? 

Well, I really didn't.  I got a Nook Color before I had a Kindle.  But, I primarily got a Kindle for reading and I got the Color for rooting and using as a budget tablet. 

If I had to do it all over again...  I'd probably do the same thing.

[apocalypse*meow]

Well, the selection on Amazon beats anybody pretty handily and personally, that was hugely important as I love a lot of obscure writers. I also liked the Whispernet/3G aspect of the Kindle particularly, over the competition. I will say that the Nook came out after I had already committed to Kindle, so I don't think I've ever looked super closely at it's features beyond realizing that I didn't like the selection you had with B&N compared to Amazon, and that was definitely a deal breaker right there anyway.

I do still have lots of people ask what my Kindle is. Once I was sitting in the sun, "smoking" my electronic cigarette and reading my Kindle. Some guy walked up and asked me "What's that?" I assumed he meant the e-cig. No, he meant the Kindle! 

[jmiked]

Well, they used to be. Before the agency pricing model, Amazon capped all their ebooks (or at least most of them I think) at $9.99. So while this is outdated info, it's understandable where it's come from.

Pre-agency, Amazon only claimed that "most" of the New York Times best-seller list would be at $9.99. Plenty of other books were more expensive (as well as less expensive, of course). They didn't cap the price so much as sell them at a discount, while paying the publishers the same as if they were not discounted.

They made no statement or guarantee that I am aware of about prices of non-NYT books.

Mike

[KindleChickie]

The biggest misconception I run into is from Nook owners who believe B&N has way more books than Amazon.  I stopped disputing it because most opinions are emotionally based.  When I get asked about why Kindle over Nook, I simply tell them Nook wasn't around when I bought my first reader but I have both and strongly prefer Amazons bookstore.

I am waiting on my UPS guy with my new DX so I can go sit at B&N.   

[history_lover]

Just out of curiosity (since the term "misinformation" is used in the subject line) what evidence are you using to conclude that Amazon's customer service is better if you live in the UK? Have you had personal experiences with B&N customer support, or are you relying on what has been said/posted by others?

I'm American and my SIL back home in the US has a Nook. She is happy with it and has never said anything bad about B&N customer support but she's never raved about it either.

Equally, it seems to be the general consensus from what I read online - I see people raving about how good Amazon Costumer Support is whereas I don't see that from Nook users on other forums.

[Stellamaz]

I can't say I run into misinformation as much as "no information" ... meaning, when I'm reading my Kindle (K2) in public I can't believe how many people still don't know what it is and have never seen one. I am always gracious about giving them a "tour."

Just as background, I bought the K2 in early 2009, and it's still my main reader and the one I have with me at all times. In January of this year I bought a Nook Color, for these reasons: borrowing library books; reading magazines; and reading in bed (back light, because I despise book lights, and no clicking buttons, which kept my hubby awake.) At that time, there was nothing from Amazon that had any of these features.

However, since I have pretty much always been an "Amazon girl" the minute the Kindle Fire was announced, I ordered it and put my Nook Color up for sale (and sold it immediately). I could not be happier with the Fire; it does everything I want it to do and more. It's not that I was unhappy with the Nook Color; in fact, I loved it. I just happen to prefer Amazon ... I guess you always go back to your first love ... :-)

[meromana]

I can't say I run into misinformation as much as "no information" ... meaning, when I'm reading my Kindle (K2) in public I can't believe how many people still don't know what it is and have never seen one.

This has been my experience as well.  When you spend so much time with a device and so much time talking about it on forums & Facebook and what have you, it seems impossible that so many people know nothing about it.  Maybe I should branch out and spend a little less time with my electronic devices!

--Maria

[Tatiana]

I'm American and my SIL back home in the US has a Nook. She is happy with it and has never said anything bad about B&N customer support but she's never raved about it either.

Equally, it seems to be the general consensus from what I read online - I see people raving about how good Amazon Costumer Support is whereas I don't see that from Nook users on other forums.

My daughter has the Nook Color and she says that B & N customer service for the Nook is poor to totally non-helpful.  When she had problems setting up her Nook last year the  B&NCS were so clueless that she ended up taking it to the IT guy in her law office and HE got it set up and ready to use.  She really isn't happy with her Nook as she feels, compared to Amazon, the books are more expensive and there is less of a selection.  Having only a Kindle I can't compare, I'm only going by what she has told me this past year.

[Meemo]

Well, they used to be. Before the agency pricing model, Amazon capped all their ebooks (or at least most of them I think) at $9.99. So while this is outdated info, it's understandable where it's come from.

The biggest misunderstanding I come across (on other forums, I don't normally read my Kindle outside the house, I have my iPhone for that) is people who are "anti-ereader" and don't understand what eInk is. They usually say something like "I read to get AWAY from a computer screen". They can't grasp the idea that eInk screens look nothing like a computer screen and aren't much different from paper and ink.

I've also seen people claim that ereaders are only for casual readers and that "real" or heavy readers aren't interested in them. 

I'm in the UK so Nook wasn't an option for me. But even had I been in the US, I would have gotten a Kindle - Amazon customer support is better, they have more titles, more promo deals, and now they have more options of models to choose from. I also find their website easier to use/browse and there are third party websites like www.ereaderiq.com for Kindle books which are very useful in many ways whereas I don't know of anything like this for Nookbooks.

They were never "capped" at $9.99 - people often missed the "unless priced otherwise" part of that sentence, which actually referred to NY Times bestsellers.  There were plenty of books priced over and under $9.99. 

It's always interesting when I take our readers & tablets to the library for their "Petting Zoo", a chance for people to get hands on with them and ask questions.  Even people who bring in their own Kindles or other readers because they don't know how to do something - I talked to a woman last week who loved her K3/KK, was talking it up to other people, but didn't realize she could get page numbers on some books by pressing the Menu key, and had never noticed the clock that appears at the top of the page when you press Menu.  I think sometimes Kindle is almost too easy to get started with - some people just start reading and never read the User's Guide!  And sometimes at these things, people ask questions and I'm not even sure what they're asking  they're clearly not into technology and don't understand the first thing about it, and it's hard to explain some of the things to them.

And yes, some of the misconceptions are pretty interesting.  A good friend of mine kept telling her husband he needed a Kindle.  He's an airline pilot and always traveled with a few books because when he's gone it can be for 2-3 weeks at a time (he mostly flies troops and equipment back & forth overseas).  He kept saying he spent too much time looking at computer screens already.  She couldn't get through to him that eInk is different until he saw one in person.  Then he bought one for himself AND for her, and they both love them. 

[Meemo]

Just out of curiosity (since the term "misinformation" is used in the subject line) what evidence are you using to conclude that Amazon's customer service is better if you live in the UK? Have you had personal experiences with B&N customer support, or are you relying on what has been said/posted by others?

You've brought this up before, but I have to ask you...
When was the last time you heard about B&N sending a replacement Nook to someone who'd dropped their Nook and broken the screen (with no extended warranty)?  For me...never.  Amazon, on the other hand, will send a replacement if it's still under warranty, and offer a discounted price on a replacement if the warranty is expired.

What happens if you return a Nook that's failed somehow?  (According to the warranty, they'll wait to get it to make sure it's really broken before they send a replacement, and I've seen people say that's what happened with them.  I hope that's changed but haven't checked recently.)  Amazon sends a replacement overnight if your Kindle is totally inoperable, a little slower in cases where it's readable but something isn't working as it should - and you don't have to return the one that's being replaced until you've received the replacement. 

What happens when you accidentally buy a Nook book, or get one that's poorly formatted or just not at all to your taste or what you thought it would be?  With a Nook, you're stuck with it.  With Amazon, you have 7 days to return it, no questions asked.

Between personal experience and hanging out on Nook boards, it's become pretty clear to me who has the better customer service & policies overall, right down to being able to go online with Amazon, click on "Call me now", and have someone on the line almost immediately, as opposed to the stories on Nook boards of folks sitting and waiting for extended periods for B&N CS.  And even when I've seen a Nook owner "praising" B&N's CS, and compared it to what I've experienced of Amazon's policies and practices, I almost always am amazed that they think that's great CS (one instance I remember is someone who would have her replacement in 10-14 days and thought that was really pretty nifty - to me it wasn't even acceptable).  So when people ask me which I recommend, Amazon's CS is one of the pluses I cite for buying a Kindle.  I know your experiences have been good with them, and sure my B&N evidence is second hand, but it's coming from Nook owners. 

[racheldeet]

The number of questions I get at work that are misinformed make me sad sometimes, and often the best thing I can do is to sit down with people with the Kindle webpage open and go through each point.

[Franklin Eddy]

why'd you choose Kindle over the Barnes and Noble one

When people asked me that I tell them is was because of the weight.  I broke my shoulder last and had to get a replacement.  However, extra weight makes it hurt so I went with the lightest one.  I am thinking of buying the $79 to replace my Kindle keyboard for that reason.

[dbeman]

You've brought this up before, but I have to ask you...
When was the last time you heard about B&N sending a replacement Nook to someone who'd dropped their Nook and broken the screen (with no extended warranty)?  For me...never.  Amazon, on the other hand, will send a replacement if it's still under warranty, and offer a discounted price on a replacement if the warranty is expired.

I can't say as I've ever known anyone who has dropped their nook and broken their screen, so I can't speak to that. My point is that most people post that they've "heard that B&N's customer service is horrible" yet very few have actually posted first hand accounts of such.

What happens if you return a Nook that's failed somehow?

From my own, personal experience when my nook ST froze up on me I logged on to B&N's online customer service chat. Within about five minutes I had a replacement on the way along with a stamped mailer to return my broken unit. All at no charge to me.

I know your experiences have been good with them, and sure my B&N evidence is second hand, but it's coming from Nook owners. 

But its still second hand; which is my point. I have no issues with anyone praising Amazon based on their their own personal experiences (and I've had quite a few good experiences with Amazon myself); but even in this thread not one person who has criticized Barnes & Noble has actually had first hand experience in dealing with them.

I vacation in Canada quite a bit; this past summer I spent a week in Quebec City, and the summer before that I spent a week in Vancouver. Both are beautiful places to visit; but I enjoyed Vancouver more. I have never been to Toronto, but I sure have heard an awful lot about it. Regardless I can't say that Vancouver is better than Toronto because I have no first hand basis for comparison.

And I only bring this up to point out the irony that a thread created to dispel misinformation is actually contributing to it.

[KindleChickie]

I can't say as I've ever known anyone who has dropped their nook and broken their screen, so I can't speak to that. My point is that most people post that they've "heard that B&N's customer service is horrible" yet very few have actually posted first hand accounts of such.

From my own, personal experience when my nook ST froze up on me I logged on to B&N's online customer service chat. Within about five minutes I had a replacement on the way along with a stamped mailer to return my broken unit. All at no charge to me.

But its still second hand; which is my point. I have no issues with anyone praising Amazon based on their their own personal experiences (and I've had quite a few good experiences with Amazon myself); but even in this thread not one person who has criticized Barnes & Noble has actually had first hand experience in dealing with them.

I vacation in Canada quite a bit; this past summer I spent a week in Quebec City, and the summer before that I spent a week in Vancouver. Both are beautiful places to visit; but I enjoyed Vancouver more. I have never been to Toronto, but I sure have heard an awful lot about it. Regardless I can't say that Vancouver is better than Toronto because I have no first hand basis for comparison.

And I only bring this up to point out the irony that a thread created to dispel misinformation is actually contributing to it.

My first hand account in dealing with them has been fair to poor.  I have had issues with purchasing books on my BN account (which I have had for about 10 years).  I constantly get a failure to purchase message when trying to buy directly from my Nook.  I have been into the store several times with no resolve.  I have to buy on my computer and then download to my Nook later.

Also, I was sold a Nook Color display unit by mistake and when I took it into the store for help they asked me if I stole it.  Talked to me pretty bad.  I didn't get any resolution so I returned it to Walmart.

I really wasn't going to go into all this because it is fruitless but you asked, so there are my accounts.

Also, they have removed book reviews and blocked me from reposting.  Same review on Amazon with no problem.

[Meemo]

I can't say as I've ever known anyone who has dropped their nook and broken their screen, so I can't speak to that. My point is that most people post that they've "heard that B&N's customer service is horrible" yet very few have actually posted first hand accounts of such.

From my own, personal experience when my nook ST froze up on me I logged on to B&N's online customer service chat. Within about five minutes I had a replacement on the way along with a stamped mailer to return my broken unit. All at no charge to me.

So I should just discount the experiences of Nook owners?  If I hear it from Nook fans, I assume that gives the stories some weight.  There are Nook owners here on KB  who've told their stories of fair to middlin' customer service from B&N.  There are Nook fans on Nookboards and other Nook forums who've told horror stories.  What else should I go by when trying to figure out how their customer service is?  For that matter, your good experience with their CS is second hand as far as I'm concerned - should I discount that as well?  I'm glad it was good for you, but that doesn't just wipe out all the bad accounts I've read from other owners. 

[kindlekinder]

I've also seen people claim that ereaders are only for casual readers and that "real" or heavy readers aren't interested in them. 

Tell them "War and Peace" is a lot lighter on the Kindle!

[sarahsbloke]

The biggest misconception I run into is from Nook owners who believe B&N has way more books than Amazon.  I stopped disputing it because most opinions are emotionally based.  When I get asked about why Kindle over Nook, I simply tell them Nook wasn't around when I bought my first reader but I have both and strongly prefer Amazons bookstore.

I am waiting on my UPS guy with my new DX so I can go sit at B&N.  

You can read any e-book on any e-reader, so it doesn't matter where it came from or who originally sold it.

I'm from the UK and originally bought the Nook, piece of buggy junk that crashed often and used the battery in less than 24hrs if in standby or in use. It sits in a drawer now, the Kindle keyboard is far superior and the battery lasts ages.

Oh, and I live in Thailand, so I don't care about CS, I won't be using it, all I want is an e-book reader that works all the time, which the Kindle keyboard does, and the Nook doesn't.

[Betsy the Quilter]

Note that, per Forum Decorum, discussions of how to remove DRM from ebooks are not allowed here, thanks.

Betsy
KB Moderator

[GeraldineB]

I'm willing to offer several different additional perspectives about books vs e-books. My background is that of a life-long book reader. I even have an MLS (MA in Library Science;) so, I'd say that I'm committed to READING. But, one thing that I learned in Library School back in '91 was that publishing is a BUSINESS. There is nothing mysterious or woowoo about it. There has been a great deal of hype invested in promulgating various ideas of specialness about books, rather than their content. There is an equal amount of specialness assigned to authors, regardless of their abilities and/or content. Most of us have bought into that belief system through habitual use patterns, but have never really examined it for factualness as we had no reason to doubt it, UNTIL the advent of digital books. So, my list would start with:

1) Books have no more or less value than their electronic equivalent;

2) Examine the reason that you read, not the method;

3) Books are heavy and cause physical discomfort for many hands;

4) Books require space to store properly, LOTS of space;

5) Books are NOT easy to move -- they are heavy;

6) Books can be damaged or destroyed by water, fire, or acts of vandalism;

7) Books can be stolen;

8. E-books are quicker to market as they require no long drawn out production cycle;

9) E-books are better for the environment in terms of trees and chemicals;

10) E-books are cheaper and will remain cheaper than hard copy production books.

We are in a time of transition between two hugely different forms of media. Library budgets are being savaged by tax-based budgets. Finding cheaper methods of sharing content will continue to be the work of libraries, but do they need the large infrastructures that they now have? Anyone who has done research into the issues of library materials' preservation knows that books deteriorate not only due to use, but due to time as the chemical content literally burns the pages. What is it we want to save as part of our heritage? The physical objects or the content?

For example, I have well over 60,000 e-books, some as multiple copies in different formats; however, they all fit on a handful of DVDs -- maybe 9. I'm going to be going with a Kindle Touch and will be uploading many of these books in order to read them on a Kindle in a recliner, rather than reading them on a computer, sitting completely upright. Most of these were free through various resource sites online.

But, the real issue is that as a retired senior who lives in an efficiency apartment is that I no longer can afford to have my hard copy books around me. I don't have the space and I don't have the funds for larger quarters. I no longer am able-bodied enough to hold most books for any length of time. Many of the books I did have and that were in storage will never be available via e-books--especially my collection of art books, quilting books, and various other non-fiction source books. Those types will continue to need to be part of Library holdings. There will never be one media that fits all.

[history_lover]

They were never "capped" at $9.99 - people often missed the "unless priced otherwise" part of that sentence, which actually referred to NY Times bestsellers.  There were plenty of books priced over and under $9.99. 

I did say "or at least most of them I think" - and jmiked already mentioned it was only the NYT bestsellers this was claimed of. I only started reading Kindle books after the agency pricing model kicked in.

I think sometimes Kindle is almost too easy to get started with - some people just start reading and never read the User's Guide!

That's not exclusive to Kindle - most people don't seem to read the user guide or manual for anything. I'm a photographer and regularly see people on photography or camera forums asking how to set this or that on their camera and I think "It's in the manual!"